Laboratory reporting working group

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Date 8th January 2025

GoToMeeting Details

Zoom link - https://snomed.zoom.us/my/pathologycrg 

Attendees 

   Andrew Perry Farzaneh Ashrafi    Gogs Byrn    Daniel Karlsson    Suzanne Santamaria  Rob Hausam  Jim Case Alejandro Lopez Osornio  Yongsheng Gao Nashar Karim  Peter GarrettPam Banning Young Bae Hansen   

Apologies

Recording 

https://snomed.zoom.us/rec/share/LCq3i56kj0vxcWFfqSIXOlzwj5vWrvqXOxrYIdLR7MexplvNTYBoLdp9cE01VFBg.AONFarR0juv_OR1U

Passcode: lNv?m1%N

Discussion items

ItemDescriptionOwnerNotesAction
1

Review actions log and issues and decisions log

KNUpdated - see tables below


2Relative concentration modelling optionsKNSee presentation slides


3





4




 AOB



Actions log

ItemDescriptionOwnerNotesAction
1

April 2025 business meeting session for this group

KN / JC

Face-to-face session would be beneficial to tackle some primary issues

Meeting slot has been allocated for Tuesday 8th April 9-12.30 CET

Jim Campbell to chair

Karim to co-chair

2

UK need to consider whether inheres_in is superfluous in lab result reporting and align with international terminology

KN / APWe agree it does not add anything but need to add to internal UK NRC log for discussion

On hold

3

Time aspect modelling

KN / AP

modelling single point in time explicitly to enable correct classification of content

Internal UK NRC log for discussion

Daniel to give a short presentation on time aspect - needs further discussion

On hold

Discussed with lab experts and the requirement is the same as the LOINC Ontology - time-specific concepts must not be subsumed by unmodelled soft default implicit 'single point in time' concepts

4SARS-Cov2 observable entity concepts for reporting viral RNA presence in the SNOMED CT International EditionFA

These concepts are modelled with both inheres_in and direct_site

Farzaneh to take these back and discuss internally for a steer on the use of inheres_in for these concepts
5Use of inheres_in for 

colour, appearance, identification

FAinheres_in  used for the property to describe the characteristic of an organism, cell or body structure - applicable to LOINC Ontology representationsSI propose to remove inheres_in but await formal decision from this group
6Representation of percentFA / SH
Discussion page on the LOINC Ontology dev side for the percent vs 'per 100 cells' and feedback to the group
7Fractions and ratiosAll IFCC-IUPAC Silverbook https://iupac.org/what-we-do/books/silverbook/ but also on the homepage: https://labterminology.com/list-of-kinds-of-property/

Proposed to revisit after reviewing the resources


8

Relative concentration of a substance in two different specimens

Relative concentration two different measurement properties

KN / DK

How do we assess effort vs impact? The requirement to model them accurately for machine reasoning - auto-classifications; erroneous subsumptions

Karim reviewed the modelling options with Daniel and presented to group

 Young Bae recommended we look at 











Issues and decisions log

ItemDescriptionOwnerNotesDecision 
1Time aspect specification in description AND modellingAllConcept is primitive if the description is more specific than the modelling. Concept logical definition must not be more specific than concept description

Must be stated consistently  in description AND modelling in accordance with SI editorial policy

2Inheres_in is superfluous in lab result reportingAllInheres_in effectively duplicates direct_site. They are two different perspectives (lab and clinical) of the same target

Direct_site attribute sufficiently captures specimen and derivable substance / site from specimen modelling 

LOINC Ontology to model direct_site

NPU to model inheres_in

Create interoperable rules and document in guidance 

What about the requirement to classify extensions?

3

Representation of percent

All

Concept is primitive if the description is more specific than the modelling. Concept logical definition must not be more specific than concept description

Represent percent in the description and the unit in SNOMED CT in accordance with SI editorial policy - provisional decision?

4

Inconsistencies - International content for cancer synoptic reporting by immunohistochemistry

1255078008 | Percent of cell nuclei positive for proliferation marker protein Ki-67 in primary malignant neoplasm by immunohistochemistry (observable entity) |

All

Does not use percent unit in modelling

e.g. 1 - modelling time_aspect -> single point in time but not stating this in the description

In contrast to LOINC Ontology examples that do state 'at single point in time' in the description and model in the logic

e.g.2 - use inheres_in whereas LOINC Ontology used direct_site

SI are adding percent unit to the content

Awaiting formal decision on inheres_in from this group

Awaiting formal decision on time_aspect from this group






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